Author Topic: Ireland, Northern Ireland and Brexit  (Read 306 times)

bababarararacucucudadada

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Ireland, Northern Ireland and Brexit
« on: December 04, 2017, 07:33:31 PM »
Well that went well, didn't it!!

Earlier today it was being touted that there was agreement between the UK and Ireland to arrange special dispensation regarding border restrictions, including whether there should be a border in any meaningful sense at all.

Next thing we have Nicola Sturgeon saying "we want the same agreement for Scotland" and the DUP saying: "not on your Nellie! We are British and we'll have the same rules as the rest of the UK."

This kills the UK/Irish agreement stone dead. It also places the confidence and supply agreement the DUP has with the Conservatives under some strain and the DUP are not known for their williingness to engage in compromise.

So the DUP is, in effect, demanding the hardest of Hard Brexits possible meaning in turn we have no negotiating position with the EU whatsover other than to aim for Brexit as a cliff's edge.

And it leaves Theresa May as PM in as weak a position as any PM could fear to endure because if the DUP ends their S&C agreement she'll have to soldier on as a minority government despised in equal part by the Brextremists (or do we prefer "Beleavers"?) and Remoaners alike.

What a complete mess.

The only constant here is that everybody in the Conservative Party seems to be utterly incompetent and impotent to do anything other than see Brexit implode due to its own contradictions.

barky

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Re: Ireland, Northern Ireland and Brexit
« Reply #1 on: December 04, 2017, 09:03:39 PM »
Looking more & more like UK gov will implode very soon and then UK either remains in EU -OR- enters a CETA style deal following many EU rules

barky

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Re: Ireland, Northern Ireland and Brexit
« Reply #2 on: December 04, 2017, 09:04:34 PM »
UK being forced to do as 10 hardline extremist NI MPs want is feckin crazy

bababarararacucucudadada

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Re: Ireland, Northern Ireland and Brexit
« Reply #3 on: December 04, 2017, 09:30:01 PM »
Where do you begin on this?

It is bewildering that Theresa May should negotiate an agreement with the Irish Taioseach and for it then to be all but published and for no thought at all be given to the DUP's stance on the matter.

I am far from expert in Irish/Northern Irish politics but surely this was entirely foreseeable? It's almost the DUP default position on everything to oppose whatever the Irish government wants, isn't it?, and the DUP has made clear it opposes any move that would separate Ulster from Britain, politically, economically or in any other way. Last week, it went as far as to brief that it would have to consider its support for the government in the case of Theresa May ignoring its preferences.

And our PM didn't take any notice?

Sir Rocis de Liver

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Re: Ireland, Northern Ireland and Brexit
« Reply #4 on: December 04, 2017, 09:42:00 PM »
Quite.
It is unbelievable.
This utterly useless PM negotiates behind the back of the very people who keep her in power to keep NI in the EU in spite of the UK’s Brexit vote.
Uniting Ireland st a stroke.
Utterly loathsome as this bunch of homophobic, creationistic hooligans the DUP are,  at least they stand their ground.
There are no limits to this woman’s incompetence.
And now we have, of course, Sturgeon waking up to the possibility of remaining.
And the Brexit Minister, David Davies?
He’s more concerned with defending an allegedly lying and squalid colleague.
Curtain measuring time, Mrs. C.
« Last Edit: December 04, 2017, 09:43:43 PM by Sir Rocis de Liver »

bababarararacucucudadada

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Re: Ireland, Northern Ireland and Brexit
« Reply #5 on: December 04, 2017, 10:02:24 PM »
David Davies is prepared to resign from government if Damian Green is sanctioned for having a colossal amount of porn on his HoC desktop.

Essentially he is defending the expenditure of tax payers' money that has been spent on the equipment needed, the building that houses it and the wage paid to somebody who wants to knock one off in his office: DD is pro state-sponsored wanking, in effect.

Unless somebody else did it using Green's log in, his desk, his office and, presumably his box of tissues too.

In which case Green has shared his password in breach of the HoC IT protocols all MPs sign up to and has handed somebody or somebodies, probably without the necessary security clearance, access to emails and other documents only ministers, not even MPs but ministers, should have access to and given that Green is First Secretary of State and Minister for the Cabinet Office and deputises for May at PMQs that'll be just about everything there is.

This is the calibre of people we have at the highest echelons of our government.

Sir Rocis de Liver

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Re: Ireland, Northern Ireland and Brexit
« Reply #6 on: December 04, 2017, 10:19:49 PM »
Well said.

Alizarin

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Re: Ireland, Northern Ireland and Brexit
« Reply #7 on: December 04, 2017, 11:12:58 PM »
David Davies is prepared to resign from government if Damian Green is sanctioned for having a colossal amount of porn on his HoC desktop.

Essentially he is defending the expenditure of tax payers' money that has been spent on the equipment needed, the building that houses it and the wage paid to somebody who wants to knock one off in his office: DD is pro state-sponsored wanking, in effect.

Unless somebody else did it using Green's log in, his desk, his office and, presumably his box of tissues too.

In which case Green has shared his password in breach of the HoC IT protocols all MPs sign up to and has handed somebody or somebodies, probably without the necessary security clearance, access to emails and other documents only ministers, not even MPs but ministers, should have access to and given that Green is First Secretary of State and Minister for the Cabinet Office and deputises for May at PMQs that'll be just about everything there is.

This is the calibre of people we have at the highest echelons of our government.

I doubt he really gives a stuff about Damien Green, TBH.  He's just getting his excuse in early.  Since when did any Tory MP win admirers in the Tory heartlands by defending MPs accessing porn on the tax payer's time and at the tax payer's expense! Especially one of David Davies' style who likes to think he's the darling of the Tory grass roots.  Tory voters have had it drilled into their tiny heads for decades that the overpaid, wasteful, public sector bureaucrat sits by the devil's side.
 
In my view, he's looking for an escape route out of this shambles.  A long time Europhobe and strong opponent of the EU.  The job he's in should be his dream job really, but like many Brextards he's woken up and smelt the shit coffee that Brexit is and realises it's one thing to grandstand in Parliament and write hack pieces for sympathetic UK Tory rags, it's another thing getting down to the Realpolitik of Brexit.
« Last Edit: December 04, 2017, 11:21:16 PM by Alizarin »

bababarararacucucudadada

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Re: Ireland, Northern Ireland and Brexit
« Reply #8 on: December 04, 2017, 11:21:27 PM »
You may be right.

Davies has exhibited a shocking grasp of his brief and made so many errors... It has become ever harder to tell if he was lying or just incompetent.

Here he is on the Andrew Marr Show denying that Brexit would entail a £50bn exit fee.

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/video/2017/sep/03/david-davis-50bn-brexit-divorce-bill-nonsense-video

Here's what is really happening.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-42161346

And there is so much more I could point to like the civil service reports that he hasn't read and doesn't want to release and... Oh I can't be arsed.

bababarararacucucudadada

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Re: Ireland, Northern Ireland and Brexit
« Reply #9 on: December 04, 2017, 11:35:04 PM »
We started Brexit negotiations offering no transition period, 20 bn euros maximum, and no special arrangements for Northern Ireland. Now it’s 2-3 years transition, 60 bn euros, and special arrangements for Northern Ireland.

One by one every single objective that Brexit was supposed to deliver is falling apart before our very eyes. If much more goes there'll be no point in continuing.

Sven

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Re: Ireland, Northern Ireland and Brexit
« Reply #10 on: December 05, 2017, 07:06:22 AM »
We started Brexit negotiations offering no transition period, 20 bn euros maximum, and no special arrangements for Northern Ireland. Now it’s 2-3 years transition, 60 bn euros, and special arrangements for Northern Ireland.

One by one every single objective that Brexit was supposed to deliver is falling apart before our very eyes. If much more goes there'll be no point in continuing.

Good.

This is democracy in action by the way.

Reaching compromise and seeking the best solution for all.

Sir Rocis de Liver

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Re: Ireland, Northern Ireland and Brexit
« Reply #11 on: December 05, 2017, 09:41:59 AM »
Foster is a bloody liar.
There is already ‘divergence’ in NI.
No abortion, no same sex marriage, for example.
Still, it doesn’t justify the stroke Maybot tried to pull.
Foster and Maybot.
Could politics sink any lower?

tequila_nic

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Re: Ireland, Northern Ireland and Brexit
« Reply #12 on: December 05, 2017, 10:03:54 AM »
https://order-order.com/2017/12/04/sadiq-sturgeon-deliberately-misleading/

'Sadiq is lying, Sturgeon is deliberately misleading, and the pro-Remain media are lapping it up…'

Nic

plandalet

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Re: Ireland, Northern Ireland and Brexit
« Reply #13 on: December 05, 2017, 12:33:24 PM »
https://order-order.com/2017/12/04/sadiq-sturgeon-deliberately-misleading/

'Sadiq is lying, Sturgeon is deliberately misleading, and the pro-Remain media are lapping it up…'

Nic

What do you think "remaining in regulatory compliance with the Common market" means?

barky

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Re: Ireland, Northern Ireland and Brexit
« Reply #14 on: December 05, 2017, 04:54:29 PM »
https://order-order.com/2017/12/04/sadiq-sturgeon-deliberately-misleading/

'Sadiq is lying, Sturgeon is deliberately misleading, and the pro-Remain media are lapping it up…'

Nic
says the compulsive bullshit spreader