Author Topic: Gender  (Read 169 times)

Je

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Gender
« on: August 26, 2017, 08:59:11 AM »
What is a woman? What is a man?

This is an interesting read:

https://medium.com/postmodern-woman/what-is-a-woman-a-personal-journey-f404a4f699e4

I've been of the ignorant born male therefore male opinion. But have been looking at gender issues lately.

Looking at pictures of trans 'women' who have had hormone treatment and facial feminising surgery and hair removal but not the vaginoplasty surgery... they look stunningly female despite still having a penis... so those female cues possibly outweigh the most obvious one of them all.  Though in person my reaction might be different...





« Last Edit: August 26, 2017, 09:07:21 AM by Je »

bababarararacucucudadada

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Re: Gender
« Reply #1 on: August 26, 2017, 08:58:52 PM »
Best to think of gender and sexuality as a continuum rather than a binary. Each of us is what we are. No more no less.

Je

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Re: Gender
« Reply #2 on: August 27, 2017, 08:48:13 PM »
Best to think of gender and sexuality as a continuum rather than a binary. Each of us is what we are. No more no less.

Man vs woman is a bit binary. A lot of these sex change things are purely cosmetic... like vaginoplasty or hair removal. But hormonal induced breast growth and lactating are not... that's defo some kind of turning into a woman-like something.

Someone was holding up gender studies as the example of a nonsense uni course. I'm completely disagreeing now. I reckon there's a whole load of important stuff to study and still solve.

Je

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Re: Gender
« Reply #3 on: August 28, 2017, 11:42:43 PM »
BTW what is a man or woman, I didn't answer you.
I took the virginity of a post op transgender.
Sadly I feel I was used.
If she had told me beforehand in my attraction for her.
The outcome would have been better.
Still who writes the rules to life?
I know it should not have made a difference, I should have coped with the shock and got over it.
The truth is my heart was broken.
I wish she could have trusted me, a failing on my part.
It wasn't selfish on my part I felt her pain and trauma and what she had been through,
it is not her fault she didn't tell me, who would advertise the fact?


This was in the news lately:

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/man-stab-woman-119-times-transgender-told-date-mississippi-hotel-room-dwayne-hickerson-dee-whigham-a7860591.html

She should have told you IMO... no question... it would've been a huge challenge to me if someone had done that to me. I know we're supposed to be perfect and all liberal minded and everything... but... my liberalism doesn't stretch that far. Call it a flaw whatever. Telling you afterwards is not the thing to do... the right person isn't going to mind... and they're far more likely to not-mind if you trust them with it rather than spring it on them after. If you're not okay with it - then you can both move on in the search for that right person... all the quicker if you're told...
« Last Edit: August 28, 2017, 11:47:02 PM by Je »

New World

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Re: Gender
« Reply #4 on: August 29, 2017, 09:10:11 AM »
Man vs woman is a bit binary. A lot of these sex change things are purely cosmetic... like vaginoplasty or hair removal. But hormonal induced breast growth and lactating are not... that's defo some kind of turning into a woman-like something.

Someone was holding up gender studies as the example of a nonsense uni course. I'm completely disagreeing now. I reckon there's a whole load of important stuff to study and still solve.

That was me, and I still think it's nonsesne. There isn't anything important to study here IMO. I fully accept and respect the fact that you disagree, but for me this great gender debate is born out of the rampant narcissism of the generatrion of 'self' and serves only as a distraction from the real meal and potatos issues humanity faces; climate change, the threat of nuclear devastation, inevitable global economic collapse, the ever widening divide between richest and poorest and the deliberate and strategic grinding down of the little man by the corporate machine.

The notion that our existential problems and dissatisfaction with the world can be solved by growing some breasts, or wearing high heels, or having a cosmetic penis sewn on is a very dangerous diversion from reality. I also think that trying to steer very young children down a non binary path is a form of abuse, more about satisfying the parents fashionable world view, than serving the best needs of a the child. If a child decides a more informed age that he/she is the other or niether, having actually lived the alternative, then fair play to them, but otherwise, it a big no no.

I apologise for any offence caused by my views. Maybe I'm not ready for a non gender specific world.

Je

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Re: Gender
« Reply #5 on: August 29, 2017, 11:32:40 AM »
There isn't anything important to study here IMO.

I thought this before a couple of weeks ago and I started looking at it. An interesting question to me is the neuropsychology of human attraction. What in the male brain makes female features attractive and the reverse in the female brain.


from the real meal and potatos issues humanity faces; climate change, the threat of nuclear devastation, inevitable global economic collapse, the ever widening divide between richest and poorest and the deliberate and strategic grinding down of the little man by the corporate machine.

There is a gender aspect to this though. A lot of the violence in the world is male-male violence. - so maybe the solution requires an understanding of the gender element. In the Bible a people are conquered - the men are all killed, the women and children enslaved. That's gender at play.

The notion that our existential problems and dissatisfaction with the world can be solved by growing some breasts, or wearing high heels, or having a cosmetic penis sewn on is a very dangerous diversion from reality.

There seems to me to be something very self-focused or self-absorbed about changing gender given the huge cost of the operation and so on. If that money was spent on other people's real medical need...

But then I think the same about people buying flash cars.

New World

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Re: Gender
« Reply #6 on: August 29, 2017, 12:08:33 PM »
I thought this before a couple of weeks ago and I started looking at it. An interesting question to me is the neuropsychology of human attraction. What in the male brain makes female features attractive and the reverse in the female brain.


There is a gender aspect to this though. A lot of the violence in the world is male-male violence. - so maybe the solution requires an understanding of the gender element. In the Bible a people are conquered - the men are all killed, the women and children enslaved. That's gender at play.

There seems to me to be something very self-focused or self-absorbed about changing gender given the huge cost of the operation and so on. If that money was spent on other people's real medical need...

But then I think the same about people buying flash cars.

The point about attraction - IMO - is that sexuality is a spectrum. All men and all women are born with some inclination towards their own gender. Nature makes the female form attractive to the male whose inclination is predominantly toward the female, by virtue of hormone balance and early life experience, to maximise the chance of reproduction and survival of the species.

Men have naturally dominated throughout history due to their superior physical strength. I don't believe men are naturally more intelligent. We are at least more enlightened than we were even 50 years ago, and it is a no brainer that women should have excatly the same opportunities as men, in education, career etc. What the idea of a non binary world leaves out is the chance to celebrate the very real and positive differences between men and women. There is nothing wrong with being a man or a woman.  I'm very uncomfortable with the craze for wanting to homogenize and make everything exactly the same, in the name equality. It's actually contrary to the concept of diversity if nothing else, which is something proponents of non binary also ironically seem to champion.

Sometimes violence is necessary. Yes, it's often used in very dubious context, rather than in defence, but that's not down specifically to the male influence, and in the theatre of war decisions to abusively weild power are often made by women in positions of great power. Equally important is the counterbalance of the more reasoned, patient and compasionate female influence.

I agree with your last statement regarding the cost of sex change procedures, and I don't believe they should be offered on the NHS, because although it's probably beyond a cosmetic procedure, it is a lifestyle choice ultimately. It can't really be likened though to spending your own mney on a flash car, because the rest of us aren't paying for that.

captainfly

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Re: Gender
« Reply #7 on: August 30, 2017, 04:48:56 AM »
Men as a whole are proven to take more risks, an evolution ary strategy that has advanced society for better or worse.

And there is a huge role that gender plays on an individuals personality that is shaped by both nature and culture. 




Je

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Re: Gender
« Reply #8 on: August 30, 2017, 09:57:58 PM »
Men as a whole are proven to take more risks, an evolution ary strategy that has advanced society for better or worse.



Quote

Today’s research is challenging the idea that men are risk-takers and women are those “better angels.” Study after study shows that there is more variance within one sex than between the two—and that’s in a variety of cognitive and behavioral tasks. Some recent meta-analyses, or studies that look at results across a variety of risk-taking studies, have found that when it comes to thrill-seeking and adventure-seeking behaviors, there isn’t much of a gender divide at all anymore. Now that skiing, skydiving, and other extreme sports are more available, women are trying them!



https://www.forbes.com/sites/emmajohnson/2016/02/29/1227/#701c8f0665e4





Quote



No gender difference in risk-taking behavior, study suggests



https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2011/06/110608081555.htm


Quote
Not-So-Strong Evidence for Gender Differences in Risk Taking

Based on a growing body of experimental and other studies, two recent economics survey articles claim to find “strong evidence” that women are “fundamental[ly]” more risk-averse than men. Yet, much of the literature fails to clearly distinguish between differences that hold at the individual level (categorical differences between men and women) and patterns that appear only at the aggregate level (statistically detectable differences in men's and women's distributions, such as different means). There is a resulting problem of possible misinterpretation, as well as a dearth of appropriate attention to substantive significance. Additionally, one of the two surveys suffers from problems of statistical validity, possibly due to confirmation bias. Applying appropriate, expanded statistical techniques to the same data, this study finds substantial similarity and overlap between the distributions of men and women in risk taking, and a difference in means that is not substantively large.


http://www.tandfonline.com/doi/abs/10.1080/13545701.2015.1057609?journalCode=rfec20
« Last Edit: August 30, 2017, 10:02:57 PM by Je »

Sir Rocis de Liver

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Re: Gender
« Reply #9 on: September 10, 2017, 12:46:07 PM »
Very thoughtful and interesting Thread.
I, too, would wince at the mention of 'Gender Studies'
Am I missing something?
Is not the act of choosing to add a penis or breast to one's body, a clear affirmation of the fact that there are two sexes?
And 'anti-homogenising'?
« Last Edit: September 10, 2017, 01:40:38 PM by Sir Rocis de Liver »