Author Topic: I have the guts to say this .2  (Read 666 times)

Visitor

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Re: I have the guts to say this .2
« Reply #15 on: July 07, 2017, 01:40:27 PM »
Try reading every post ive made in this thread where i actually said that they were wrong for calling her that and giving her the middle finger.   Im not defending their behavior, ........



Why are you assuming I have not read ( carefully)  your every post on the thread? I know you disapprove of their behaviour. I don't doubt it.

That was not the point I was making.

You are much more disapproving of her than them. Much more exercised by her than them. I wanted to know why her emotional manipulation is, to you, worse than theirs. That is, if you accept their behaviour was emotionally manipulating in the first place, of course.

Guzman

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Re: I have the guts to say this .2
« Reply #16 on: July 07, 2017, 01:58:37 PM »
Quote
During the resurgence of the confederate battle
flag in the 1950's & 60's, it was widely used by
white segregationists to block & harass peaceful
civil rights marches throughout the South. These
marches were often also met with ruthless police
brutality & massive illegal arrests.

The confederate flag was created waaaaaayyy before the 1950s and 1960s were, it was created during the american civil war.  Its not the original creators fault as far as what a group of people in the 1950s and 60s chose to do.   To be fair to it, you have to go back to its original roots of origin.  You even have black people from the south that are proud to display the confederate flag.   Many people display it (or even have tatoos of it) purely as a sign of "im southern proud" and thats it.   Kind of like how you get people saying that Morris dancers who black their faces are being racists, even though Morris dancing with that tradition came several hundreds of years before minstrel shows ever did.


Then you have read the BTL comments, which always seem to be strongly influenced by a certain type of responder, and thought "I'll put that on RB. It'll make me look good"

So what influences you or anybody else to make threads on RB?.  I could apply that same motive to anybody on here hypothetically.

I'm very surprised that I am the only person to have taken her side but, I guess, that is rather more reflective of the sites that you have seen the video discussed on. Try putting it on Mumsnet and see what response you get.

I dont know much about the Mumsnet site, but from having a brief look at it, it seems to be a place mainly for adult women, especialy those that are parents.  I think many women will stick up for the woman in the video and see no blame in her at all for it, because from my experiences, alot of women do seem to have this attitude of "us women need to stick together".   What about that american womans talk show called The Talk which Sharron Osbourne presented, where all the women on the pannel and all the women in the female only audiance laughed at a man getting his penis severed off by a woman.

But when i look at a situation and try to judge it fairly, i dont let myself get caught in by the halo effect.

Visitor

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Re: I have the guts to say this .2
« Reply #17 on: July 07, 2017, 02:08:15 PM »
The confederate flag was created waaaaaayyy before the 1950s and 1960s were, it was created during the american civil war.  Its not the original creators fault as far as what a group of people in the 1950s and 60s chose to do.   To be fair to it, you have to go back to its original roots of origin. 

Indeed you do.

It was a symbol of racial supremacists from the beginning.

Why do you think it still appeals so much to White Supremacists today? For its pattern?
« Last Edit: July 07, 2017, 02:11:41 PM by Visitor »

Guzman

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Re: I have the guts to say this .2
« Reply #18 on: July 07, 2017, 02:38:21 PM »


It was a symbol of racial supremacists from the beginning.




You know what......Im just gonna make this as a reply




Sven

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Re: I have the guts to say this .2
« Reply #19 on: July 07, 2017, 03:03:34 PM »
I didn't say you weren't no matter how lacking in emotional intelligence your view is.

The way this looks to me is that you have found a video that a certain brand of person will look at and see either a woman taking a principled stand against a symbol of bigotry, prejudice and worse and another will see as a "snowflake" whining about nothing that matters: the exact same factors influence both sides and the reasoning behind her objection is exactly the same as the reasoning influencing her opponents.  Then you have read the BTL comments, which always seem to be strongly influenced by a certain type of responder, and thought "I'll put that on RB. It'll make me look good" except it doesn't because it makes you look like an apologist for all sorts of isms and ogynies.

I hardly know you at all so I am loathe to make sweeping generalisations about you as a person but as a contributor to these boards you bring a charming kind of innocence to the place but it isn't big and it isn't clever to join in with the braying mob as they seek to bully and intimidate. It does, however, take a particular sort of courage to make a stand against that same mob.

I'm very surprised that I am the only person to have taken her side but, I guess, that is rather more reflective of the sites that you have seen the video discussed on. Try putting it on Mumsnet and see what response you get.


I am certainly against her being "bullied" or further picked on by anon internet dots, and the like, but my take on this is that those people do have the right to sell things they believe has a market.
Their approach to someone who does not agree with this is vile, but that is their choice to treat custom like that unfortunately.
I am not saying it justifies their approach, they should know better than to threaten and intimidate a young woman in such a way. Especially as she is unlikely to be a physical threat.

However, at the same time, she did go into their business and tell them how to run it. Racially charged material or not, she should have expected a reaction on the side of hostile.

But either way Guz, you are not looking so good with sexist language and posting up the confederate flag.

http://www.historynet.com/embattled-banner-the-convoluted-history-of-the-confederate-flag.htm

That link is a nice balanced reflective history of the flag in question, and its real uses and what it has come to mean over the years.

While it was never expressly flown in the civil war years as a symbol of hate, people today have come to associate it with white power movements, and therefore slavery and racism.

It is not as comparable to the Nazi Swastika emblem as many make out, but I understand that many people do find it an offensive flag, so unless you expect to offend, don't wave it around.

bababarararacucucudadada

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Re: I have the guts to say this .2
« Reply #20 on: July 07, 2017, 04:49:43 PM »
The confederate flag was created waaaaaayyy before the 1950s and 1960s were, it was created during the american civil war.  Its not the original creators fault as far as what a group of people in the 1950s and 60s chose to do.   To be fair to it, you have to go back to its original roots of origin.  You even have black people from the south that are proud to display the confederate flag.   Many people display it (or even have tatoos of it) purely as a sign of "im southern proud" and thats it.   Kind of like how you get people saying that Morris dancers who black their faces are being racists, even though Morris dancing with that tradition came several hundreds of years before minstrel shows ever did.

So what influences you or anybody else to make threads on RB?.  I could apply that same motive to anybody on here hypothetically.

I dont know much about the Mumsnet site, but from having a brief look at it, it seems to be a place mainly for adult women, especialy those that are parents.  I think many women will stick up for the woman in the video and see no blame in her at all for it, because from my experiences, alot of women do seem to have this attitude of "us women need to stick together".   What about that american womans talk show called The Talk which Sharron Osbourne presented, where all the women on the pannel and all the women in the female only audiance laughed at a man getting his penis severed off by a woman.

But when i look at a situation and try to judge it fairly, i dont let myself get caught in by the halo effect.

You do pick bizarre examples to support your case...

I have never seen the programme nor the item you mention but there was a famous case where a woman, possibly the spouse - I forget, severed John Wayne Bobbit's (was that his name?) penis as he attempted to force himself upon her. It wasn't just a case of mad woman chopping innocent bloke's dick off. Funny? Hardly. Then again the mere mention of the word "penis" is probably something of a rarity on US daytime TV so it probably gets a giggle every time.

I think Mr Bobbit and his member were surgically re-introduced to one another and he went to star in at least one porn film.

What makes me post what I do? Dunno really. I'd like to think occasionally I amuse, stimulate or challenge and make the boards a slightly more interesting place but do I yearn to be accepted into some sort of gang? No. Couldn't care less if I was the only person to think as I do. In fact I think I'd be rather pleased were that the case.

As for Mumsnet... I've never looked at it because I am not that sort of woman but see no reason to challenge your characterisation of it nor the likely response were you post that video there. In fact your précis is exactly why I suggested it because I would anticipate a lively and robust response which you might find educative.

Sven

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Re: I have the guts to say this .2
« Reply #21 on: July 07, 2017, 11:21:51 PM »
Guz, what are you trying to be?

I get that you are a bit miffed by women, as I know some of your history in this area. I will not share that here unless you wish it.

However, this is not the right approach when you have had your feelings hurt or your heart broken.
There are women who are bitches, yes.
There are plenty of PEOPLE in general who are shits who will want to make life difficult for you and hurt you for no reason other than their own personal amusement.

Assuming that all women are like this, and trying to single out some random woman on youtube, is not going to endear you to other women, or impress other people.

People reading this do not think you are a tough guy standing up for decency, male rights, and out to stop these emasculating femmi-nazis from imposing their will on people.

They think you are bit of a misogynistic loser,  who takes his lack of fulfiling relationships with the opposite sex out on random women on the internet.

I am not sure where you get this pro Confederate Flag thing from however.

My honest and balanced advice taking anything else I know about you into consideration is stay the fuck out.
Its not really your business.
There are smarter and far nicer things to have an opinion about.
Who are you going to impress, other than White power fellows and well, other isolated people angry at society because of perceived unfairness/social alienation/misplaced anger at people based upon skin colour?

Look. I do know you better than you want me too, and over the years I have come to the conclusion that underneath all of your uniqueness, you are a fundamentally decent bloke who just wants people to appreciate him for who he is.

You are not going to achieve that through acting like a hateful dick, because I know that is not you. You never struck me as racist and no one likes a sexist, rude, guy. 

bababarararacucucudadada

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Re: I have the guts to say this .2
« Reply #22 on: July 07, 2017, 11:45:00 PM »
Pretty much what Sven says (although I barely know you).

There's lots of hate on the internet. More than enough. There really is no need to add to it. You'll find much more satisfaction and acceptance by not being a part of it than by joining in unless you wish to be validated by a load of neo-fascist, misogynistic, knuckle-dragging, warped, redneck scum in which case you are doing just fine so carry on as you are.

As an aside you have caused me great offence on this thread but probably not for any of the reasons you might suspect. In fact it is possible, probable even, that quite how will forever remain a mystery... It is such a delicate matter that I hate to bring it up, actually, and I am far from proud of myself for doing so so please accept my apology for raising the matter because, no matter how it might appear, I am not one of them.

Guzman

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Re: I have the guts to say this .2
« Reply #23 on: July 08, 2017, 08:48:34 AM »
Ok Sven, i do actually have some problems here in the last reply you just made to me.  Your emulating your old classic self a bit here by misrepresenting both myself and the message i was trying to convey, especially with this bit here

Assuming that all women are like this, and trying to single out some random woman on youtube, is not going to endear you to other women, or impress other people.

Where are you getting the notion from that i am declaring ALL women to be like this?.  I never said that, this is kind of quote miming me here.  Some are like this, and that video is evidence of it.   But theres many women out there who do not use the act of crying as emotional manipulation, they only do it for just cause.  Look at the situation from the second womans perspective aswell.   She turned up to the store and never got to see what the other woman did inside the store before leaving it.  I wonder if that woman 2 or 3 or 4 days later got to see the whole video clip on youtube and thought to herself "i cant believe i fell for it all......there really was no smoke without fire here".   They were wrong to swear at her back and give her the middle finger, but she still drew first blood.  What would of happend if she just saw the flag, disapproved of it being there, and then just decided to just not shop there again (which is what i would of done)......nothing would of happend.

I showed that video clip to my best friend the other day, and he agreed with my sentiments.  He thought the woman was being emotionally manipulative in the car park and considered her rude for having the audacity to go into the store and publicly show them up and video recording them without their permission.

This thread was never about anti woman, anti ethnic minorities or pro confederate flag really, it was anti sjw and anti ignorance.  Im not american or southern american origin, so from a personal bias, i really dont care about the confederate flag, id never even have a reason to ever wave or wear or display it.   I do agree with the general princibal though.  I dont like the fact that other people out there have to pamper to the ignorance of sjw's so not to offend them, why dont the sjw's instead take the time to learn history fully?.  Im not american but yet ive taken the time to read more about the american civil war, so why cant american sjw's do the same?.  I posted up that confederate flag pic in this thread as a lazy way to make a response to Visitor, because as i have picked up on the concept that he is widely accepted as a troll on here, that i really couldent be bothered to waste time looking for a website that talked about the historical origins of the confederate flag to back up that its not about pro white supremacy or pro slavery.

Sjw's are also being ignorant like this towards Morris Dancers who black their faces.   Trying to make out that its copying minstrel shows.  This is sjw's putting the cart before the horse here, considering that morris dancers blacking out their faces is something that was being done like 400 years ago, which totally pre dates minstrel shows.  Bo and Luke in the Dukes of Hazzard had the confederate flag on their car roof, but were they white supremacists or racists?, totally not.

bababarararacucucudadada.....believe it or not, my intention yesterday was to not make anymore posts directed towards you in this thread after the one you made at 4.49pm, because i realised that if we just kept going back and forth with each other, then the thread would of just dragged on way longer past its productive course, but as you have made another one towards me, i have to say something back again, even if small.  Dunno how i have cause you great offence to be honest, the thread was never personally about you.  Id never take great offense if a woman on the internet made a thread attacking another man about something, i would just see it as your beef is just with him.
« Last Edit: July 08, 2017, 08:51:40 AM by Guzman »

bababarararacucucudadada

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Re: I have the guts to say this .2
« Reply #24 on: July 08, 2017, 09:20:28 AM »
I knew you wouldn't get it.

Guzman

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Re: I have the guts to say this .2
« Reply #25 on: July 08, 2017, 09:32:40 AM »
I knew you wouldn't get it.

Well you saying "it has caused me great offence" sounds rather over reactive if im gonna call a spade for a spade here.   Why should it?, inless you are exactly like that woman and ive hit a nerve.   Its fine if you dont agree with me or you cant stomach too well what ive said, but to be greatly over offended by it?, sounds rather over emotionally invested.

bababarararacucucudadada

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Re: I have the guts to say this .2
« Reply #26 on: July 08, 2017, 09:36:38 AM »
It's nought to do with women, flags, racism.

I'm probably over-egging the pudding here but you've inadvertently boiled my piss by hitting not so much a nerve but more a pet hate.

Sven

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Re: I have the guts to say this .2
« Reply #27 on: July 08, 2017, 06:01:36 PM »
It's nought to do with women, flags, racism.

I'm probably over-egging the pudding here but you've inadvertently boiled my piss by hitting not so much a nerve but more a pet hate.

Defending Morris dancers?

Seriously though, what specific thing has got to you.
I am not sure, and if I am not sure, Guz here has no fucking idea!

It's better to be clear if something is boiling your piss, than expect others to guess.

Sven

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Re: I have the guts to say this .2
« Reply #28 on: July 08, 2017, 06:27:08 PM »
Ok Sven, i do actually have some problems here in the last reply you just made to me.  Your emulating your old classic self a bit here by misrepresenting both myself and the message i was trying to convey, especially with this bit here

Assuming that all women are like this, and trying to single out some random woman on youtube, is not going to endear you to other women, or impress other people.

Where are you getting the notion from that i am declaring ALL women to be like this?.  I never said that, this is kind of quote miming me here.  Some are like this, and that video is evidence of it.   But theres many women out there who do not use the act of crying as emotional manipulation, they only do it for just cause.  Look at the situation from the second womans perspective aswell.   She turned up to the store and never got to see what the other woman did inside the store before leaving it.  I wonder if that woman 2 or 3 or 4 days later got to see the whole video clip on youtube and thought to herself "i cant believe i fell for it all......there really was no smoke without fire here".   They were wrong to swear at her back and give her the middle finger, but she still drew first blood.  What would of happend if she just saw the flag, disapproved of it being there, and then just decided to just not shop there again (which is what i would of done)......nothing would of happend.

I showed that video clip to my best friend the other day, and he agreed with my sentiments.  He thought the woman was being emotionally manipulative in the car park and considered her rude for having the audacity to go into the store and publicly show them up and video recording them without their permission.

This thread was never about anti woman, anti ethnic minorities or pro confederate flag really, it was anti sjw and anti ignorance.  Im not american or southern american origin, so from a personal bias, i really dont care about the confederate flag, id never even have a reason to ever wave or wear or display it.   I do agree with the general princibal though.  I dont like the fact that other people out there have to pamper to the ignorance of sjw's so not to offend them, why dont the sjw's instead take the time to learn history fully?.  Im not american but yet ive taken the time to read more about the american civil war, so why cant american sjw's do the same?.  I posted up that confederate flag pic in this thread as a lazy way to make a response to Visitor, because as i have picked up on the concept that he is widely accepted as a troll on here, that i really couldent be bothered to waste time looking for a website that talked about the historical origins of the confederate flag to back up that its not about pro white supremacy or pro slavery.

Sjw's are also being ignorant like this towards Morris Dancers who black their faces.   Trying to make out that its copying minstrel shows.  This is sjw's putting the cart before the horse here, considering that morris dancers blacking out their faces is something that was being done like 400 years ago, which totally pre dates minstrel shows.  Bo and Luke in the Dukes of Hazzard had the confederate flag on their car roof, but were they white supremacists or racists?, totally not.

bababarararacucucudadada.....believe it or not, my intention yesterday was to not make anymore posts directed towards you in this thread after the one you made at 4.49pm, because i realised that if we just kept going back and forth with each other, then the thread would of just dragged on way longer past its productive course, but as you have made another one towards me, i have to say something back again, even if small.  Dunno how i have cause you great offence to be honest, the thread was never personally about you.  Id never take great offense if a woman on the internet made a thread attacking another man about something, i would just see it as your beef is just with him.

And you are going back to your old ways of writing a long passage angry at other people because of how you have come across.

What did we say about this last time Guz? Read your passages back to yourself and try to think if other people will get your meaning.

The confederate flag was created waaaaaayyy before the 1950s and 1960s were, it was created during the american civil war.  Its not the original creators fault as far as what a group of people in the 1950s and 60s chose to do.   To be fair to it, you have to go back to its original roots of origin.  You even have black people from the south that are proud to display the confederate flag.   Many people display it (or even have tatoos of it) purely as a sign of "im southern proud" and thats it.   Kind of like how you get people saying that Morris dancers who black their faces are being racists, even though Morris dancing with that tradition came several hundreds of years before minstrel shows ever did.


I dont know much about the Mumsnet site, but from having a brief look at it, it seems to be a place mainly for adult women, especialy those that are parents.  I think many women will stick up for the woman in the video and see no blame in her at all for it, because from my experiences, alot of women do seem to have this attitude of "us women need to stick together".   What about that american womans talk show called The Talk which Sharron Osbourne presented, where all the women on the pannel and all the women in the female only audiance laughed at a man getting his penis severed off by a woman.

But when i look at a situation and try to judge it fairly, i dont let myself get caught in by the halo effect.

Right, the second part is what I will address here first.

It looks a lot like you are saying that women in general will side with the woman in the video you posted, because women have an attitude of "sticking together".

Sure you are not saying "every single woman" but you are still sounding like you are tarring a large proportion of women with the same brush.

Yes, Sharon Osborne and TV show audience found John Wayne Bobbit's fate "funny". But not because all of them actually want to chop off dicks. Its more that they might have felt like it, but known they would never do it.

The idea of someone finally going through with it, does raise a titter. If you don't get why, you won't get why.

I don't think you judge things fairly.

Right now, you come across like you have been reading some Redpill mens rights nonsense and think that feminists and SWJs are in the main trying to suppress men, to prevent them from expressing themselves, and not having any fun.

That is also what leads onto your odd support of the confederate flag.
Sure it has not always meant what people use it to mean today, but the fact of the matter is that people do use it as a white supremacy symbol today, just as the Swastika has historical uses, but the most famous use today is negative and racist.

Morris dancers, were originally "Moorish" dancers. It was a style of dance said to have been practised by the Moors in Spain. Moors were North African origin and if not outright black, tended to be darker than the European population of the day, hence face blacking is actually quite racist in this context.

All of the Morris dancers I ever saw did not do the face blacking thing, not that I asked each individual their own reasons for doing this, but I can gather that it fell out of popularity because it is offensive to do so. 

I am really trying to be on your side here and explain how you are coming across and sounding.

I know you don't want people to think you are a racist misogynist.

bababarararacucucudadada

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Re: I have the guts to say this .2
« Reply #29 on: July 08, 2017, 06:50:26 PM »
You're right but I'll come across as bit of a grammar Nazi if i do and I'm not keen on them myself...

So putting that paradox to one side and wallowing in what can only be described as hypocrisy might I respectfully point out that one of the posts in this thread included this sentence:

Quote
What would of happend if she just saw the flag, disapproved of it being there, and then just decided to just not shop there again (which is what i would of done)......nothing would of happend.

Once grated but I ignored it. Twice and I would've questioned my sanity for not commenting but still did not do so. Thrice and I'm a full-on fucking grammar Nazi: jackboots, armband, silly moustache - the works.

Do not ever do this unless you want to make yourself look like a completely fucking ignorant, lazy, stupid, useless c**t who might be excused if about 6 years old but as an adult (I assume you are an adult) there is no mitigation.

I know this is only a crappy messageboard that nobody cares much about and is pretty much entirely disregarded by the rest of creation apart from the few of us who post here. I know we all make typos. I know some spell better than others. I know some people are dyslexic and just can't help it. I like to think that I am a reasonable man and am happy to make allowances (none of the other errors in that sentence bother one tiny bit) but (and everything before the "but" is bullshit never forget) there is no excuse, there is never an excuse, there will never be an excuse for any of the following:

might of (unless saying, e.g., "the might of the millitary machine" etc)
could of
should of
would of

It is "would have" that you are saying not "would of". You are fine to use the contraction "would've" should you wish to. Perfectly OK. Not a problem.

Mistaking "of" for " have" is a heinous crime against all that it means to be English and to be privileged to have been given the English language as a mother tongue. It is a sick perversion. It is not an aberration it is an obscenity. It has no place in written communication under any circumstances.

Am I reacting hysterically to this? No. Have I gone completely over the top on something that really does not matter? No. It is an abomination beyond description there is no greater crime commitable when using written words. How wrong is it? Very wrong. Very wrong indeed. And then some. And then some more.

It's almost as bad as people saying "haitch" when refererring to the letter "H". I'm a wishy washy love-the-world be-nice-to-everybody sort at heart but these two things release my inner fascist. I would happily execute people who commit either crime without trial. They do not deserve indulgence, time or respect; they deserve the old "hung, drawn and quartered" treatment (once the entirely gratuitous session of torture is over) and when drawn their entrails should be thrown on a fire before their dying eyes and their head put on a spike when all is done; once such unutterable atrocities have been committted you forfeit all rights to decent treatment because you have rendered yourself as worse than vermin, worse than the fleas that live on vermin, worse than the diseases that the fleas that live on vermin carry and spread. You are worse than nothing. You are intellectual untermensch.

Got it?

[walks away from keyboard to try to calm down before really losing it completely]
« Last Edit: July 08, 2017, 06:54:34 PM by bababarararacucucudadada »