Author Topic: Glastonbury 2017  (Read 1360 times)

V8

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Re: Glastonbury 2017
« Reply #60 on: August 11, 2017, 02:34:52 PM »
Dubai is a distraction.

We are talking about this issue. This case.

Don't get sidelined.

It is another tactic to not discuss the issue.

Who gave you permission to dictate which direction any discussion goes in here? Israel wasn't relevant to a discussion about Glastonbury until it was brought up, and now Waters is part of the discussion I think it's relevant to show what a hypocrite he is and how he  seems to only selectively care about the oppressed.

Visitor

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Re: Glastonbury 2017
« Reply #61 on: August 11, 2017, 02:35:59 PM »
"French BDS activists convicted of Holocaust denial

The accused claim they ‘accidentally’ posted an image comparing the Israeli army to Nazi Germany.

Two Boycott, Divestment and Sanctions (BDS) activists were convicted by a Montpellier court for incitement and Holocaust denial and fined 3,000 euros ($3,400), according to the French news site Libération.

Saadia Ben Fakha, 26, and Husein Abu-Zaid, 58, will also have to pay each of the civil parties that joined the case against them a symbolic one euro in damages: League of Human Rights (LDH), International League against Racism and Anti-Semitism (LICRA), France-Israel Association, Movement against Racism (MRAP), Lawyers without Borders, and the anti-Semitism watchdog BNVCA.

In August 2014 the members of BDS France 34, the local branch in Hérault, posted on social media an image comparing the IDF to Nazi Germany along with a caption saying "The Nazis and Zionists are two sides of the same coin," and that "What Hitler did to the Jews was done so that the world will sympathize with them and give them all the rights."

LDH, which often participates in BDS activities, discovered the Holocaust-denial post and requested that it be removed. It was only when LDH turned to the police that BDS condemned the post and denied any responsibility.

Holocaust denial has been illegal in France sine the 1990 Gayssot Act.

The two accused claimed that they accidentally clicked and shared the post without ever reading or seeing the image. BDS 34 supported its two activists and denied they were anti-Semitic, and even held a rally in their support.

However, LDH discovered that Ben Fakha also posted pictures of IDF soldiers along with inappropriate comments, and photos of herself making a reverse Nazi salute.

BDS then condemned LDH because they exposed the issue, and allowed “Zionist” groups (i.e French racism and anti-Semitism watchdogs groups) to join as plaintiffs."


It's relevant to Waters because he's actively and publicly backing the BDS campaign.


Which particular Zionist site did you get this from?

You should know that the Zionist lobby in France is even worse than here and the laws in France are even more geared against those who dislike Israel's behaviour.

Just in that little bit we have the nonsense about the ' reverse Nazi salute' and this idea that what are called Zionist groups are nothing of the kind but are just 'French racism and anti-Semitism watchdogs'

As if  :ROFL:

Just for background, even readers of Haaretz understand some of the enormous bias in French society against Palestinian activists and how the law is supercharged against them.

If haaretz knows how come you don't?

The whole article is educative.
http://www.haaretz.com/jewish/1.574361

Quote
  When Farida Trichine and 11 of her friends burst into a French supermarket in 2009 and began applying stickers with anti-Israel slogans to vegetables imported from the Jewish state, she expected to be escorted from the store by police.
What she didn’t expect was to be convicted of inciting racial hatred and slapped with a $650 fine.
Three months ago, a court in Colmar convicted the 12 activists under a French law that extended the definition of discrimination beyond the expected parameters of race, religion and sexual orientation to include members of national groups.
What Trichine, who was wearing a “boycott Israel” shirt during the protest, saw as a protected act of political speech was being treated by the authorities like a hate crime.



And so it goes.



Visitor

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Re: Glastonbury 2017
« Reply #62 on: August 11, 2017, 02:43:40 PM »
Who gave you permission to dictate which direction any discussion goes in here? Israel wasn't relevant to a discussion about Glastonbury until it was brought up, and now Waters is part of the discussion I think it's relevant to show what a hypocrite he is and how he  seems to only selectively care about the oppressed.


Hypocrisy is not the worst crime, even were it proved.

So good of you to misrepresent Waters.

http://www.facebook.com/BDSNationalCommittee/videos/vb.115083011869901/1621084234603097/?type=2&theater


He tackles this question in the recent interview; not your one from 2015. He does care about and actively work on other causes.

Even if he didn't one really is allowed to choose a cause. just one. Sometimes one cause takes up your time and energy. Sometimes one cause demands it and demands specialisation so you know the case in detail.

THAT applies particularly to Palestine so the Israeli propagandists and their fellow travellers don't get away with their shit on sHIT masquerading as some kind of flower bed scented with the finest Arabian spices.
« Last Edit: August 11, 2017, 03:41:33 PM by Visitor »

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Re: Glastonbury 2017
« Reply #63 on: August 11, 2017, 02:55:46 PM »
No, it's not like calling him an anti-semite at all, I've never done that and don't believe he is. I'm calling him a hypocrite for calling out people paying Israel because of the oppression there, while playing other countries with oppressive regimes. That makes him a hypocrite.


Are you aware of how Waters is being called an antisemite and how there is a film coming out to demonise him as such; because of his involvement in BDS.

So if you don't think he is where do you stand on this attack on him as one? Do you think it is just propaganda?

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  Wish You Weren't Here - The Trailer; Film Coming Summer 2017
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Ian Halperin
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Published on Jun 3, 2017
A shocking, explosive and most compelling film by award winning filmmaker/No.1 NY Times bestselling author Ian Halperin. Is Pink Floyd leader Roger Waters an anti-Semite? Is he the de-facto leader of BDS? Find out in this jaw dropping documentary about contemporary antisemitism combined with Waters rise to the forefront of the BDS movement, and his controversial journey attempting to get all artists to boycott Israel. Halperin, the son of a Holocaust survivor, traveled the globe for two years to get to the bottom of this incredible story, meeting up with and filming hundreds of experts from all faiths, including Ronald Lauder, Pope Francis, Haras Rafiq, Palestinian and Israeli leaders, U.S., British and French government officials, The Chief Rabbi of Ukraine, Alan Dershowitz and Dr. Charles Small. A riveting film that is a must view for everyone!!

Please visit www.wedontneednorogerwaters.com


One really does laugh at these propagandists. Do they think it will work? For all time?

Visitor

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Re: Glastonbury 2017
« Reply #64 on: August 14, 2017, 03:31:27 PM »
Who gave you permission to dictate which direction any discussion goes in here?


Eh? I did not know any permission had been asked nor that I had dictated any direction for the discussion. You have discussed what you wanted to.......

Quote
   Israel wasn't relevant to a discussion about Glastonbury until it was brought up, and now Waters is part of the discussion I think it's relevant to show what a hypocrite he is and how he  seems to only selectively care about the oppressed.


The thing is, his supposed hypocrisy is actually irrelevant; the call for Radiohead not to go to Israel is not dependant on Waters; the call was from Palestinians themselves and from lots of others apart from Waters.

Are you planning to accuse all of them of being hypocrites too, so your argument, apart from the antisemite and holocaust denier motif, carries the weight you have for your argument?

Is it just me, again, that thinks your arguments are poor quality?

Just for fun listen to the so called hypocrite.

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Visitor

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Re: Glastonbury 2017
« Reply #65 on: August 14, 2017, 03:58:05 PM »
Quote
  If he had, then he wouldn't have written an open letter having a go at them. He tried to strong arm them into not playing there with suich a move, that's not accepting they are allowed a choice.

Firstly, he did not write the letter (he just signed it along with many others), secondly the letter was only published after numerous attempts by different people to  contact Radiohead about the issue. Thirdly, you call this strong arming.....did you read the letter in this looking into the matter you did? And Radiohead obviously had a choice........they went too.....and gained a lot of new friends in all the Israeli Embassies around the world and with all the Israeli propagandists like the ones you cited earlier.

They are now big fans. They quote him and are using his arguments  :ROFL: Who knew that Israel would make the most out of the band going to play in an arena built on one of the many Palestinian villages destroyed by the 'Israelis' in 1947-48. Lovely new found supporters of the band have been tweeting their fanhood. :ROFL:

For some reason  ::) Mark Regev seems to not have joined the fan club very ostentatiously. :ROFL:

https://artistsforpalestine.org.uk/2017/07/19/radiohead-gig-promoted-by-israeli-diplomatic-missions-around-the-world/

« Last Edit: August 14, 2017, 04:09:28 PM by Visitor »

Visitor

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Re: Glastonbury 2017
« Reply #66 on: August 14, 2017, 04:06:08 PM »
You can test for yourselves just how strong-arming the letter was.

https://artistsforpalestine.org.uk/2017/04/23/an-open-letter-to-radiohead/

Visitor

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Re: Glastonbury 2017
« Reply #67 on: August 14, 2017, 04:19:14 PM »
Quote
  Add the fact that antisemitism rises in the wake of their ( meaning BDS) activities and it doesn't paint them in a great light.

Hook line and sinker. :clap:

You really do swallow the whole thing, pre-wrapped and with cutlery provided. Just have to bring your own napkin. Special delivery from sources close to the israeli propaganda expeditionary forces.

What you, surely, mean is that with BDS comes increased knowledge of what Israel actually does.

Q13.1

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Re: Glastonbury 2017
« Reply #68 on: August 14, 2017, 10:59:17 PM »
I see vis is up to his usual. What a pratt. Wants to stake a claim and the only way vis can is off the back of others. It is so tedious to see.

Visitor

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Re: Glastonbury 2017
« Reply #69 on: August 15, 2017, 02:11:29 PM »
I see vis is up to his usual. What a pratt. Wants to stake a claim and the only way vis can is off the back of others. It is so tedious to see.

I often have difficulty understanding what you write and why.

What kind of claim do you think I am staking? On the back of whom?

As to tediousness, you are some kind of master of that, don't you think?

As to your motive for these off topic personal attacks could you explain why you do this, please.

Anyway, apart from the personal attack do you have anything relevant to write about the topic? Apart from something about Roger Waters being 'a cretin' and playing in Pyongyang.

If Waters is a cretin what does that make you? He is  a very successful, eminent rockstar of some pedigree as opposed to............
« Last Edit: August 15, 2017, 02:16:50 PM by Visitor »

Q13.1

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Re: Glastonbury 2017
« Reply #70 on: August 15, 2017, 11:04:04 PM »
I often have difficulty understanding what you write and why.

What kind of claim do you think I am staking? On the back of whom?

As to tediousness, you are some kind of master of that, don't you think?

As to your motive for these off topic personal attacks could you explain why you do this, please.

Anyway, apart from the personal attack do you have anything relevant to write about the topic? Apart from something about Roger Waters being 'a cretin' and playing in Pyongyang.

If Waters is a cretin what does that make you? He is  a very successful, eminent rockstar of some pedigree as opposed to............

Thanks for the reply vis. Waters is one sad prick who thro his toys out out of the pram which led to the ending of the floyd, even tho it was well passed its sell by dare. He played in the zionist entity didn't he? You condone him for it? Why is PFF your latest friend?

If you want to rage about the Palestinian cause HowTF can you do it on a thread about Glasto 2017?
just what is the connection?  Hence my reference to you doing your usual. And you condone waters for performing there?
in the entity not glasto. Just where the hell are you coming from?

Visitor

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Re: Glastonbury 2017
« Reply #71 on: August 17, 2017, 12:59:50 PM »
Thanks for the reply vis. Waters is one sad prick who thro his toys out out of the pram which led to the ending of the floyd, even tho it was well passed its sell by dare.

Relevance to thread was there none.

Instead of getting answers to the questions asked,
Quote
What kind of claim do you think I am staking? On the back of whom?

Quote
As to your motive for these off topic personal attacks could you explain why you do this, please.

 I got this........

Quote
   He played in the zionist entity didn't he? You condone him for it?

He did play in Israel, yes. In 2006. Radiohead before this, I'm told, last played in Israel in 2000 so to go back now after all that time obviously was significant huh? A big deal.

Who says I condone it? He is free to play when and where he likes.  The best thing about him playing there was he learnt and has acted on what he learnt, since.

The best thing about Radiohead going there now is the publicity about Palestine, especially thru BDS.

Quote
  Why is PFF your latest friend?

How do you think up the crap you write? :ROFL:

Quote
  If you want to rage about the Palestinian cause HowTF can you do it on a thread about Glasto 2017?
just what is the connection? 

It is a logical development from how the thread went. Radiohead were the topic, barky pointed out Yorke was a knob, V8 decided holocaust denial and antisemitism should get an airing and said BDS was 'a questionable organisation' on the back of him looking into the topic ( howling laughter)........... etc etc so what would you expect?

How could anybody just listen to this blatant vicious propaganda without pointing it out. And laughing at V8's pretensions to knowing anything about what he is talking about.

He thinks there is equivalence calling someone an antisemite and holocaust denier and calling someone an Israeli supporter, depending on which side you are favourable to. One is so so so so damaging an accusation and the other neutral and actually often regarded as something to be proud of but V8 USED THE SUPPOSED EQUIVALENCE as part of his argument.

Quote
  Anybody who opposes Israel is automatically labelled an antisemite and preferably labelled a holocaust denier.

It is the shortest cut to deny them a voice.


Quote
  And it works both ways, anyone who doesn't oppose Israel is labelled an Israel sympathiser and supporter of all the shit going on there, for the same reasons.

The argument is bogus.


Another supposed equivalence was that Waters played in Israel in 2006 so surely that means Radiohead should be able to play there in 2017.

Doesn't anybody realise a lot has happened since 2005? the situation is not the same. There might have been an excuse for being pig ignorant then; there is none now.



Another bogus one was about playing in oppressive states  and Dubai was cited as if Israel and Dubai are comparable in oppression. They are not.

And if you think they are, why isn't anyone who thinks that, ever having a go at Captainfly for working there?

V8 always uses hypocrisy as his go to argument; does anybody think there is any hypocrisy here, not even thinking badly of Captainfly working there but being appalled that Waters would.

Q, you must have views on that and V8 must too........


I love this forum. :ROFL: :ROFL:
« Last Edit: August 17, 2017, 01:49:03 PM by Visitor »

Visitor

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Re: Glastonbury 2017
« Reply #72 on: August 17, 2017, 01:08:50 PM »
V8 still has not replied to the query about what he thinks of the those, unlike him, who think Waters is an antisemite.

tequila_nic

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Re: Glastonbury 2017
« Reply #73 on: August 21, 2017, 10:52:22 AM »

It's relevant to Waters because he's actively and publicly backing the BDS campaign.


It is.  The issues with the BDS campaign and antisemitism are well documented and why people would want to be associated with this KNOWING these issues exist should raise some pertinent questions to those who are interested.

Nic

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Re: Glastonbury 2017
« Reply #74 on: August 21, 2017, 11:40:13 AM »
It is.  The issues with the BDS campaign and antisemitism are well documented and why people would want to be associated with this KNOWING these issues exist should raise some pertinent questions to those who are interested.



Who are they well documented by? V8 linked to some articles on this topic and blindly accepted them without any examination.

The Victoria Derbyshire article clearly shows "Some Jewish students in the UK say growing support for BDS has fuelled a rise in anti-Semitism on campuses."

and the other states

Quote
In my work as a pro-Israel activist and philanthropist I’m often asked: is BDS really anti-Semitic? Does it really lead to an increase in anti-Semitism?

If you look at the evidence — and examine the roots, goals, and strategy of BDS — you see that the answer is an unequivocal yes!

This latter article is by Adam Milstein who one really should already be aware of if one followed  Palestinian affairs even a tiny bit.

He is well known for being a serious and serial propagandist.

From wikipedia

Quote
  In June 2015, Milstein joined with Sheldon Adelson and Haim Saban to organize the inaugural Campus Maccabees summit.[21] The event brought together more than 50 organizations to "harness the full might of the pro-Israel community to defeat hate groups spreading anti-Semitism and lies about the Jewish State on America’s college campuses.

You must know about these guys and what they do and how much they spend doing it.

So we have 'stand with us' and other hasbara organisations with their deliberate, well financed, widespread attempts to delegitimise BDS being taken by V8 AND TEQUILA AS STATEMENTS OF UNCONTESTED AND INCONTESTABLE ' FACT'.

They are not. :ROFL: They are part of an Israeli campaign against Palestine.

In this thread V8 has unequivocally said he does not think Waters is an antisemite. Milstein et al have a huge campaign saying he is an antisemite.

Does anybody think this might make V8 think his own observation about Waters is wrong and Milstein's is correct. V8 after all cited Milstein earlier as  his evidence. :ROFL:

Which is it? Is V8 correct or is Milstein?  One of you is wrong. Why the variance? Why is Milstein saying what he says?

The Israeli Government  and others have put a lot of effort into delegitimising BDS. It works easily with some.

Others might question it, especially with such a blatant case as this. Is Waters an antisemite? Are you with Milstein or V8?

And why is there this discrepancy? :ROFL: :ROFL:

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   Adam Milstein - IAC Retweeted
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 #Miami says NO to #RogerWaters message of #racism and #antisemitism.
« Last Edit: August 21, 2017, 11:42:52 AM by Visitor »